Jennifer: 0:24

Welcome to another episode of Behind the Dreamers. I'm your host, Jennifer Loehding, and we are talking to the achievers, the creators, the magic makers and the dreamers. These are our friends, these are your friends and they are living the extraordinary Well. I'm so excited about my guest today. This is going to be a lot of fun. I'm excited to hear what he has to talk about, but he's basically has an innovative approach to illustrate the love languages, and this unique method not only helps you understand the five love languages, but also empowers you to actively give them away. The system is designed to be effortlessly accessible accessible, making it suitable for even young children, and he says it's a game where everyone emerges as a winner. So I'm super excited to hear about this and share this with you. But before we bring him on, I do want to do a quick shout out to our sponsor.

Jennifer: 1:08

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Jennifer: 2:52

So with that, let's get our guest on here today. So Paul Zolman is an international best-selling author of the Rule of Love. He says in his book you'll find what helped him move from a childhood boot camp of abuse to being a person who loves everyone and can find good about anyone in any circumstance. So, Paul, welcome to the show. We are so excited to have you here today.

Paul: 3:12

Thank you, Jennifer. What a pleasure to be with you. It's going to be, so much fun. I've been looking forward to it.

Jennifer: 3:17

Awesome, awesome. We had a fun talk off of this, and so I'm excited about what you've got and your story, and so I kind of want to open this up, so tell us a little bit about this unique approach to expressing these love languages.

Paul: 3:30

The unique approach was something that I created, jennifer, that really I needed a replacement behavior for residual anger I had from a childhood, and the unique approach is using a cube. Actually, I created a cube that has the love languages on it. There you'll see two hands touching one another that represents touch. Here's a hand holding a gift that represents gifts, hand holding an hourglass that represents time and holding a platter that represents service. And then, of course, two hands together forming a heart with a conversation bubble out from that heart, meaning words from the heart. So that would be the word Five love languages, six sides on the cube. The last one is a hand holding a question mark. That one surprised me. So there's just two instructions. You roll the die every day, whatever it lands on. That's the love language you practice giving away all day. That day no longer it's about you or me, it's about them and about watching them when they light up. When they light up, that's what they like and that you discover their primary love language in that way.

Jennifer: 4:37

I love that. You know it's so interesting because we tend to, don't you agree that we tend to give love language which is comfortable for us, right, Like what is our love language is what we try to put out into the world and, as you know, and we all know this not everybody has the same love language, right? So if you're a person like I'm, a words of affirmation person, you know I love that and I love connection, and so if somebody has a touch thing that may not be quite as important to me, but I'm going to generally give away what like affirmation, I have no problem affirming people because that's what I love. But I love what you've got here because I think now it becomes a I have a method of let me roll this dice and now I actually have an active thing that I can do, and also it strengthens your ability to give a love language in a different manner.

Paul: 5:25

Absolutely. I would totally agree with that, and that's the whole idea of this is that we'd be all become more versed in all five love languages Over a 30 day period. You know the length of time it takes to create a new habit. Over that 30 days you'll have given away all five love languages with this method. By doing that, you become what I like to call a love language linguist Sexy title. I know you want it. Everybody listening wants that title. It's just one of those titles If you put on your resume. You go to that employer. That employer is going to say what the heck is a love language linguist? And you're going to say well, I just love people. That employer wants their customers loved and they want a loving environment within the workplace rather than a hostile environment. A lot of hostility out there. They don't want that in their workplace.

Jennifer: 6:12

Yeah, it's almost like I feel like you know we learn about like the different you're probably familiar with, like the DISC model and the Meyer Briggs and all of those. We learn about different, how people operate, right, and I feel like this is kind of a piece of that Like right. It's like now we're learning how to in the DISC model and I had to learn that in my previous career. It helped me because it gave me the ability to sort of understand how people operate and so I knew how to do my languaging and how to do it was really effective in closing and sales and stuff, because I knew how the different people would operate, how I needed to present a closing. But I think this is good too, because it's kind of the same thing. Now you're learning how to give away something so that you can meet people where they are in these different models. And you're right, I think it can make it's huge. It can make a difference in a conversation by far.

Paul: 6:58

Oh, absolutely. So. What you're watching for, jennifer, through this 30 day process or even longer. I had this copy right in 2017 and I've used it every single day since that time. But what you're watching for is when people light up, that's their primary love language and you don't have to say excuse me, could you pause this relationship for a minute while I have you take this survey so I know how to love you. It's awkward, you don't have to do awkward anymore, and that's kind of the key to that. The other thing that it does for you is it really improves your peripheral vision so that you can see it when it comes your way and then respond appropriately.

Paul: 7:38

You had mentioned, jennifer, that most people give away their primary love language, hoping that it's coming back to them. That reciprocity, to me, is really not love. It's a transaction, it's business, and if you're not on, let's make a deal. And it's not. A marriage shouldn't be like that. It should be sent out without any expectation of ever coming back, but trusting the universe. That has laws in the universe the law of the harvest, karma, the law of attraction, whatever you want to call it. Trusting that the universe will bring it back.

Jennifer: 8:13

I love that. I like that. You said the word consumer because I read a book. I think I started reading a book, tim Keller's I forgot the name of it. It's about marriage, but he talks a lot about the consumer relationship versus I forgot what the other word was but the consumer relationship, which is how a lot of things happen, right. We think of even marriage being sort of that way I give, you give in return, right. And I like this because you're coming from the angle of you just give and you don't worry about the return. And I think you're so right when you say we tend to expect the languaging to come back. And you're right, that becomes a consumer relationship. At that point, instead of just giving freely and not, we don't have all the let's say, and I think it's everything. It's not just a marriage, it's in all kinds of relationships business, friendships, every type of relationship we tend to think if we give people this way, that we should get that same kind back in return. It just doesn't work that way.

Paul: 9:03

No, it's not a retail store, and if you're sitting around waiting for customers, waiting for love to come in, it's not going to happen.

Jennifer: 9:10

Right, I love it. I love it. This is good and I like that you make kind of a game out of it. I think that's what makes it fun, because it's almost like you know I always say this when I work with clients in my coaching practice like when we're trying to make change, and it might be it could be anything from getting them to go to the gym or changing something in their business, right, Change is hard, right, and a lot of times we put a lot of metrics when we're trying to change. And I think when you can take all the metrics away and make something fun, and I would say, you know, I kind of think about like exercise, you know, like if you really despise going to the gym, don't tell yourself you got to go to the gym seven days a week, but maybe you say every day I'm going to do something that I enjoy, doing that gets me out of my house.

Jennifer: 9:48

Maybe that's one day you're walking your dog. Maybe it's one day you go skating, it's one day you go bowling. Then what happens is exercise doesn't really become the chore anymore. You get it becomes a fun thing, right. So I like that you're making a game out of this so that now it's not really even a chore at this point. It's sort of a fun challenge game.

Paul: 10:07

Absolutely. I love that, jennifer, too, that you brought in variety with that exercise. This is just the same thing. It's variety in exercising love, and it's just going to be a little bit different every single day. You know the the the last one one that I created. That surprised me on that day. You're just watching for opportunities to do random acts of kindness, or you could do any one of the love languages. Whatever you're watching for, you're watching, you're actually using. It's almost like a test. You're taking all the knowledge that you have of all the other love languages that you've learned over the course of that 30 days, and now you're having a test. You're going to be able to watch for it and you'll be able to respond to it on that surprise music.

Jennifer: 10:54

I like it. I like it. I'm gonna have to check more of it. I did look up your stuff, so I'm gonna get in there and dig a little bit more. I like it. It's very cool. I want to back it up a little bit and talk. I don't I don't do it too much detail, but want to talk about, kind of, what brought you to this, because I think we all have these journeys and the one great thing I love about behind the dreamers is we talk about everything, because I think people see us where we are like, they see us in that Space where we are now, but they don't recognize that there's a journey that gets us to that place. Right, there's something that leads us there. So maybe get this a little bit of the inspiration I know you touched on, but just maybe a little bit of the inspiration that led to this absolutely.

Paul: 11:26

As I'd mentioned, I grew up in a family of abuse. You know, 15 years ago I was in in a situation that I was single. This anger that I carried forward from that childhood actually probably was contributed Contributory to the demise of my first marriage and because of that I ended up single. So I'm single and I'm. My sister thinks I'm really lonely. She calls me. I'm seven hours away, driving seven hours away from her, and she calls me and says that she had a neighbor that she wanted to introduce to me.

Paul: 12:02

Well, prior to that, for a year and a half prior to that, I've been doing what I call destination dating. I've gone from, yeah, went to Daytona Beach, jacksonville, florida, atlanta, georgia, charlotte, north Carolina, columbia, south Carolina, new York City, kansas City, salt Lake City, phoenix, nashville, went cabal, san Lucas, all these places I went, looking for love in all the wrong places really is what it really would have wanted to spend a lot of money, had a lot of fun, but it just didn't amount to anything. I thought I had a Lead on something. I thought I had a Built, a good relationship with one of those people and she lived in Phoenix, so I moved there and it just actually went south from there, I just did not materialize. So at this point my sister's calling me, wanting to introduce his neighbor. I just told her I don't think so, because I just done all that and I'm number 10 of 11 children.

Paul: 13:01

Jennifer, oh wow, she's an older sister. So you have to do what your older siblings said, just like, and even back in the day when we didn't have remote control TVs, I was the human remote control. My older siblings would tell me you go, take the channel to this. So I'd walk up to the TV and turn the knob to the to the different channel. So so I used to be in, told what to do in that way, and you kind of dream that someday, maybe someday, I'll be able to make my own choices.

Paul: 13:33

And so I'm trying to try to put my sister off and she says, oh, come on. And I said, okay, well, I'll email this person. What kind of relationship can you develop through email? I wasn't expecting anything, but this lady was actually a pretty good writer. And then, after four or five emails, I finally came to the point I felt brave enough to ask well, how many times have you been married? And she writes back and says, counting the five that are buried in the backyard and it was just hilarious. I thought I've got a live wire here, I've got somebody's, got some personality and even a sense of humor. This might be worth pursuing. So I we start getting a little closer and then I end up moving up by my sister and we get more serious. Now it's time for big brother approval.

Paul: 14:20

So I take this woman to my brother's house that is 300 miles north and First thing that happens is when we walk in as my sister in law pulls her aside and says the only emotion that the Zulman family learned growing up was anger. At first I denied it, said uh-uh. Then it made me mad but I thought I'm really, I've been busted, you know just, I really proved her point and from that time I thought If that's the perception of the Zulman family, then I have an opportunity right here and now to change that perception. Wow. So I started reading the color code and I started reading the five love languages and really settled on the principles of five love languages. I'm Christian and Dr Gary Chapman was a pastor and he said that these reconciled to the life of Jesus Christ. So I did my own fact check and just found out how they did reconcile to the life of of Christ and thought this was really Really be a good path. But his, his application of the principles didn't work. For me, coming from where I came from, it's that angry culture has angry vocabulary, angry humor, all the put downs. They talk over one another and it's just that angry. It's a culture all by itself. I didn't know where to start. I didn't really understand the principles, but but I was trying and I wanted to do that. His idea was that well, jennifer, if I guessed what your love language is and I catered to that, we're gonna be buddies. I'm a really bad guesser, obviously, I wasn't trained to guess and trained to guess accurately, so that wasn't working for me. And then the second thing that dr Chapman says if I take this, this love language test, I find out what my love language is. Well, jennifer, what am I supposed to do with that Advertise? Well, jennifer, what are the gifts? What do you have for me today? It's just awkward. I was done with awkward.

Paul: 16:16

I found out that from this anger, that residual anger, I found out as an adult that I was doing the same thing my father would do. He would be annoyed, annoyed, annoyed, annoyed, stacked these annoyances until he had this flash of anger. What would happen is that, being number 10 of 11, my father dated my mother every Friday night. I love that about my father. I can't even keep up with that myself in my own life. How did he do that? But he'd really valued women.

Paul: 16:47

It wasn't very creative about it. It was always at the Maverick Bar, always over alcohol, and I can imagine I was never there, but I can imagine that my mother would have this conversation about how her week went with the children while he's out on the road. He was a truck driver and so he'd come home on the weekends and I think I can imagine her starting at the top, or the oldest child, and my father's getting annoyed at one child, annoyed next, next, next, I'm number 10. I'm way up here where he's going to blow and I get the belt or I get a severe spanking. I remember one time I was black and blue for more than three weeks from one of those spanking. It was just really harsh in that way.

Paul: 17:33

So I have this same stacking thing going on and I really want to overcome that. But I'm saying in my mind I don't want to be angry. It's like that double negative that only works in math, that you can multiply two negative numbers together to get a positive. It doesn't work in relationships, so it's not working for me either. So I had to figure out what to do next and so in this whole process I'm thinking I've got to figure out how to apply these love languages.

Paul: 18:04

So I contacted Dr Chapman and said asked him are you licensing those little icons that you have for each one of the love languages? Because I remember it as a child I had this idea that games brought families together. And games did bring us together. There still was all the smack talk, there still was all the put downs, there still was a strategy in the competition, all those things within that angry culture that were there. But it brought the family together. And his attorney wrote me back and said no, we're not licensing those things. So I went to a copyright attorney here in my town and he said theory like the love language theory is not copyrightable. Application is. That's when I was able to create my own artwork, put it on a die and make the die and copyright it.

Jennifer: 18:54

Wow, what a story. I think it's always fun to hear the back stories of these things, what inspires us to, and it's sometimes hard. I don't know if you find this. I feel like when I talk about my story, it's kind of long and I'm always like do you want the abbreviated or do you want the long version of it? It's like the abbreviated version is this, this, this, this?

Jennifer: 19:12

But none of these journeys are just simple. They're not linear. We talked about that. They're not. They're not simple stories, right, and I think it's what transpires in it and what's neat is, you know, that's why, in the beginning, before I preface this, as I said, you know, people look at where you are. Now. They don't know all the stuff in the middle, right? So if they were to go from here to here, they'd be like how did you go from here to here? Right, because they haven't seen the whole journey. And that's what behind the dreamers is. It's really, you know, the, the inspiration, what led to the work that you're doing today, and so I think, whatever it is that gets you there you know, tragedy or whatever that trauma or bad experience there's always good that comes out when we can take that and find a way to serve other people with it.

Paul: 19:51

That actually served as a motivator for me, jennifer, and I appreciate that question because it really really kind of was the impetus for, for change, wanting that change. Now, instead of stacking those annoyances, I find myself stat stacking the kindnesses, because just just think of that, it's a stair step to, to higher laws of love. It's, if you, if you want to get to the, the, the higher law of compassion, or the higher law of charity or intimacy or forgiveness or empathy or mercy or or sympathy any of those are all higher laws of love. These really, for me, have become the basic that everybody really needs to know the basics, and we really only know our own primary love language. We need to broaden that, to know all five love languages as the basics to be able to stair step to those higher laws.

Jennifer: 20:46

It's good, that's good, I love it. So, moving into, I want to ask kind of as an entrepreneur, because obviously you are an entrepreneur, you have a book and you have a tool and you're you've got. I went on your website to look at how you kind of packaged everything. I like it. I would love to know and have you share with the audience maybe One of the challenges that you faced and maybe you mentioned earlier about getting the copyright and having that. So I think that was something and good on you for you know, doing the research on that, because you could have easily just stopped and not proceeded with that right. So good on you for that. But maybe one of the challenges you faced, you know, maybe putting this together or Maybe you can maybe basically even on the tool in the book itself.

Paul: 21:30

Yeah, there are a lot of challenges I've. It took about two years to get the right artwork. I just wasn't satisfied with the artwork that I that was coming from my designer, and it just took about two years to get the artwork. During that two-year period I I still had the need to be able to practice the love languages, so I made my own little prototype and it was clunky.

Paul: 21:52

Just as that big. I mean it's about two and a half inches by two and a half inches square block of wood. Try to try to cut a piece of wood with the sharp corners and then try to roll that. It doesn't roll. I mean it'd be weighted if you wanted to do physical touch every single day, like a couple attorneys have asked me to make one like that For them. That's all they want to give away, that's all they want to receive. They just want one that has physical touch on every single side. But try to roll that on on the floor. It seems like a weighted die and it just isn't does. It's just was very clunky in the beginning so I had to. These are the difference in size here you can see I had to really size it down and really kind of work with it. I've had to find a dice manufacturer, just I mean a lot of things that I had to do to be able to get to this point. Then, as I'm, then now I've got the die and now I'm taking it around trying to market it and trying to go to the Mental health therapists people that that are in that industry thinking that they're gonna just just buy this like crazy, and one that I went to last year In 2022 is early in 2022.

Paul: 23:10

He said that that this is, this is great, but you have to do too much explaining about it. You really need a manual or you need to write the right a book, because it's quite different. It absolutely makes you versed in all the love languages. Quite a different application it's. You're not. There's no more guessing. There's no more Survey to take to discover what the love language. You're watching with your observation skills To discover what their love language is, and I think that's really important too.

Paul: 23:43

There there was someone, a couple that I was working with, that took the test. He found, or she found out, that she was a service, and so he's he's Mona lawn. He's. He's You're helping with laundry. He's vacuuming the carpet. He's washing the dishes. He's doing all these things, she's not lighting up when he starts rolling the die and he rolls words of affirmation. Now she's lighting up, now she's happy, now she's right. She really and it was almost like it was. She was a changed person. Once he found out what really lit her up then and started working with that, their marriage really Became more cohesive. They they just became on the same page, they understood one another, and that's the whole. Key to this is we're trying to improve communication. So so the challenges for for doing that. Just, it's a hard concept to explain. I mean, it takes a minute to explain the concept, and so that's why I'm here with you, jennifer, to yeah.

Jennifer: 24:49

No, I like it actually. I think it's really good for you know, because it's a structure to me. It's like it no longer becomes. I got to think about what to do. You've got the dye to fold the dye. Now you fall. Just it's a structure, you know, and I like it. I think, I think this could be.

Jennifer: 25:05

I'm like I need to send all my people that are having like challenge. We're like just go pick up the dye, get that book, get it, get it and check it out, because for a lot of people that's not a natural thing, it just doesn't come easily and and if they have something that says do this, they can follow that. You know what I mean. So I love it and thank you for sharing you know the things that you had to overcome, because I think that's important. As an entrepreneur, I like to say we real talk it here, because I think sometimes people again, I've mentioned this several times they see you where you are now. They don't know the hardships and the things that you had to go through to get to where you are. So thank you for sharing all that. I do want to ask you and I think you probably have said this throughout this whole conversation, but I would love for you Maybe just to touch on what do you feel like you've learned about yourself in this journey?

Paul: 25:50

I Think that the biggest thing that I've learned about myself is the source of anger, and and I think that if you can identify the source of anger, then you can you put you on the spectrum. You understand, I really, like my sister must said, I really didn't realize that I was so close to that Angry culture on that side of spectrum. I like to explain it like this the other, the other day, I went out walking and I found this walking stick. Then on one side of it's very smooth, it's about three and a half feet long, the size of a walking stick. This side is just got a knot on here and I call this the naughty side of the stick and this is the nice side of stick. You know, it's like Christmas, it's like Santa Claus has a stick like that, the naughty and nice stick. And so I realized that anger was really on that naughty side of stick and I was too.

Paul: 26:46

Once you have that self-actualization moment, that's really where you can make some goals and and make some progress. But you have to know where you're at what. What worked for me, what, what that self-actualization moment was, what I was being annoyed at, what other people were doing, that I thought I could do better, that I thought I could make choices for them and it really is none of my business. Their choice and their, their actions and doing what they're doing is was really none of my domain at all. Once I realized that that they're gonna stay out of, stay out of their business, let them make their own choices If they're, if they're failing, I can offer advice, ask permission to give advice, but unless they accept that offer or say, or they say something like no, I don't want that advice, then you're done. That's the end of the conversation. When I realized that boundary for me, that I need to stay in my lane. Well, what is my lane? Send out love and watch and react appropriately when it comes back and Not worry about the choices of other people. Once I started doing that, I realized that I Started rolling the die Simultaneously that, with that realization, came to realize that that I'm watching now for what's right about people and what can I love about people.

Paul: 28:15

I used to watch for what's wrong with people and I was looking at that 10 or 20%, the bad of a person, the minority part of a person, and when I was looking at that minority part of a person, I was missing this whole huge majority of what's right about that person. Now, as I roll the die and watch for what's right about that person, that's the huge change there. I am so busy even on one person. You can find so many good things about them to talk about. I'm so busy watching for what's right about people. I have no time to be annoyed no time. And it was a replacement behavior for me, jennifer. So that replacement, I needed that replacement. I didn't know what to do with the anger and I would say I wanna stop and do all those stop and not do that, but all those negative statements. What do I wanna do was more positive. My brain accepted that the die helped with that and start focusing on what's right about people. That really was the biggest change that I've ever seen. They take away.

Jennifer: 29:20

I love it, paul, it sounds to me, I mean, in listening to everything that you're talking about and I love this because I think that when we begin to serve other people, that's when we have the most transformation in our own life, and so what I'm in this whole thing, I feel like it's for you, what I'm hearing from you is that this whole process to heal yourself, it really was found in trying to find ways to serve other people and it healed you in a lot of ways. So I think that's the best way to achieve success is helping other people right, and I always say that we learn the most when we're doing service. Like you know what, when we have to find a way to help somebody and we have to learn in the process to do it, we grow and I love it. I was listening so many things you said throughout this. My friends make fun of me because I always talk about. I get the chills when I have these conversations and sometimes I do a show. I love all my people that have been on the show and sometimes I'll have like one time where I'm like I get the chills.

Jennifer: 30:08

I've been listening to your whole thing on this. Every time you say something I'm like, oh my gosh, oh my gosh, like I can resonate with this because I think that so much of my work that I've been doing and what I do with other people has really been about healing myself. It's been about letting go of anger and things that I've held onto and misplaced and being able to find good. And I really love, like I said, this dye because I think it takes away the have to think about it. Now. It's just you've got the direction right.

Jennifer: 30:34

You take the dye. It tells you what you need to do for the day. That's your active service. Follow the dye. It's simple for people to follow. Once they know it, I love it. One last question I wanna ask you before we close this out. You've said so many great things, but any advice that you would give to somebody right now, maybe that wants to take it away? Let's just talk about writing a book. Maybe they want to go and pursue their passion of starting something, whether it's a book or whatever their calling is right now.

Paul: 31:00

Yeah. So probably the best thing to do and what I found really very helpful was to write all your ideas down, and the advice I had was put them in 10 columns on a wall. Just make a sticky note of any idea that you have and then organize it into 10 columns. As they're organized it into columns, then pretty soon you'll have a whole list of, or a whole column of, sticky notes on your wall. That's one way. I'm kind of an accounting background type person. The spreadsheet worked just as well for me, and that really was how it worked as I organized the book in the chapters what do I wanna write in this particular chapter and then ideas would come. When the ideas stopped coming, then was the time to start writing, and it only took six weeks. That whole process of writing the book only took six weeks after I had the ideas down and out on the spreadsheet for me, and it was just. It was that simple, you know.

Paul: 32:04

The other thing that we haven't talked about is I've got a journal as well. This is called the Role of Love Journal, and in it most journals would have a blank page. This one actually provides suggestions what you rolled, what opportunities you saw to love in that way what you did about those opportunities. People really need that accountability. Just think it took me a long time to realize that I'm responsible for my own actions. I kept blaming my father being the victim, blaming my father for all the anger and everything, up until about age 35, that I realized oh, I'm responsible for my own stuff and I think that when people realize they're responsible for their own stuff, that's gonna help launch their business as well. It's gonna be. You're in charge. You are the person. If it's gonna be done, you need to do it, or you need to find someone that can help you do it. I think that's probably the best encouragement that I can give right there.

Jennifer: 33:03

Yeah, all great advice. I love that. I have an accounting background too, by the way. That's why I was smiling when you said that I had somebody on my show one time. I did my mother was a bookkeeper and so I thought I was gonna go into accounting and do CPA. And then I got to tax law which has nothing really to do with that and I was just out of it. But I had somebody come on my show one time and he's like no, I just don't see you being an accountant, so I didn't pursue it. But, paul, this has been great. If our audience wants to get in touch with you, maybe they wanna pick up the journal, they wanna get this. I know you have these in packages and stuff. Where would you like us to send them?

Paul: 33:37

Probably the best place is to therolloflovecom R-O-L-E of lovecom and you'll find the bundle package that we talked about. It's the, it's the cube, it's the book, it's the journal All for $29.99 right now. It's about 20% off what the retail price is and it's just that special that we have going on right now for anybody that's listening.

Jennifer: 33:58

Okay, that's good, that's excellent, and so when I love the journal, by the way, I think that that's great. I was listening when you said that. I was thinking gratitude is what that really comes down to, absolutely. At the end of the day Love it, so this has been great. I wanna tell you thank you so much for your authenticity. Thanks for sharing. I love what you're doing and it was fun chatting with you and learning a little bit more about this.

Paul: 34:18

Thank you, jennifer, it's been my pleasure to be with you Awesome.

Jennifer: 34:21

Awesome and to our audience, of course, we do wanna say if you enjoy our show, head on over to Apple, give us a review over there, hit that subscribe button on the YouTube so we can keep sharing all these fun and fabulous stories and talking to these amazing people. And, as I always say, in order to live extraordinary you must start, and every start begins with a decision. You guys, take care, be safe, be kind to one another. We will see you next time Because, wow,